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Question

Given the modern day age of misinformation, surely someone has pondered and tested their ideas of a truth that sustains (a truth that sustains refers to the ideas that sustain the confidence of those truth seekers while still retains being a legitimate source of truth). Where can I read more about these ideas and the means to achieve it?

Background

This ted talk shows

... A global crisis of fake news and disinformation. Which meant our free knowledge movement really sort of stood alone. At the same time we saw a collapse in public trust around the world in many of our civic institutions ... People around the globe are increasingly skeptical in the ability of these institutions to respond to our future challenges and changing needs. And yet trust in wikipedia actually went up!

She proceeds to introduce concepts like Minimum viable truth, constructive friction, user empowerment and diversity, etc as a means to achieve this.

Then there are others like ground news which empower the reader by many providing many perspectives.

I'm guessing given the importance of this someone must have already written a book or thesis about an enduring, nuanced perspective of truth and a means to achieve it. Where can I read more about this?

Geoffrey Thomas
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More Anonymous
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    What do you mean with "a truth that sustains"? The quote seems about Wikipedia (as a reliable source of information/knowledge) vs institutions (as a source of lie and deception)... – Mauro ALLEGRANZA May 27 '22 at 13:51
  • a truth that sustains refers to the ideas that sustain the confidence of those truth seekers while still being a legitimate source of truth. – More Anonymous May 27 '22 at 14:17
  • Read any good info on Nonduality. – Scott Rowe May 27 '22 at 16:46
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    There are only two large categories of truth: objective truths & contingent truths. All other variations are more than likely emotional & fall under the field of Psychology. You can Google what contingent truths are. Basically they are claims that are temporary and hold true. That is claim x is rue on Monday and false on Wednesday. It has false instances! An objective you can also look up. Objective truth holds forever. It never has a false instance. All triangles are geometric shapes holds forever, all bachelors are unmarried men holds forever and so on. – Logikal May 28 '22 at 15:15
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    @Logikal: I'd downvote your comment if I could. In non-Euclidean space, like the one we occupy, triangles do not behave like that. A 'bachelor of arts', could already have been married before beginning their degree - words change their meanings. – CriglCragl Oct 25 '22 at 21:48
  • @CriglCragl Therefore: all truths are contingent. QED (what about that one?) (shhh!) – Scott Rowe Oct 26 '22 at 13:19
  • @CriglCragl, Can you provide a single example of a triangle that loses geometric form entirely? I mean it was once a triangle and now it is not a geometric figure of any kind anymore without human interference. Triangles must have three sides correct? I never said anything about a Bachelors of Arts; That would refer to a type of college degree not a human being. I stated the word BACHELOR which refers to a human being & that human being is an unmarried male. Is that always true or is it not in English? – Logikal Oct 26 '22 at 16:39
  • @ScottRowe, All truths cannot be contingent because we have examples of truth values that do not change. In math for instance they claim a tautology is a statement that is always true. I suppose you object to mathematics? They also claim a contradictory statement is always FALSE and is never true. You would seem to be at odds with math again correct? How can you have it both ways that there are no objective truths but yet make an objective claim yourself? Do you understand you claim "There are no objective truths" is a statement if true will be constantly true? Make it make sense. – Logikal Oct 26 '22 at 16:44
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    When we think hard though, we find 'true' isn't in the 'facts', it is in the whole situation of evaluating them, and never stands separately from them. From my answer here: https://philosophy.stackexchange.com/questions/81655/why-is-a-measured-true-value-true/81664#81664 Objectivity is just reified intersubjectivity: https://philosophy.stackexchange.com/questions/92058/the-unreasonable-ineffectiveness-of-mathematics-in-most-sciences/92064#92064 My point about triangles & bachelors, is *you picked those* as examples definitionally objectively true, but that's not how language, or truth, work. – CriglCragl Oct 26 '22 at 18:31
  • These seem to be Emotional Truths. – Scott Rowe Oct 26 '22 at 20:23

2 Answers2

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One aspect to consider is a social contract with a shared idea of truth. I would say science has this, with a picture that truth is tentative, and confidence in it relates to what evidence we have for it. Discussed here: Philosophical assumptions underlying science

Another way to think about truth, is that it is about a commitment not to try and pursuade at any cost, which we can relate to wisdom. Discussed here: Wisdom and John Vervaeke's awakening from the meaning crises?

And another way, is to think about what values we seek to transmit and keep vital beyond our own lives, in order to give our lives and those of others meaning. Discussed here: What are some philosophical works that explore constructing meaning in life from an agnostic or atheist view?

I relate the defining of what philosophy is, the pursuit of truth, to Socrates and Socratic dialogue, as the commitment to discourse that aims at uncovering truth without fear or favour, even in a society that will make you drink hemlock for doing that. It personally did not ensure that Socrates was sustained. But by pointing to wisdom that looks past those trying to pursuade without regard to truth, and towards a social-contract that became philosophical discourse and the Academy and the Lyceum, Socrates pointed to something deeper about, what truth is worth being sustained for. The unexamined life not being worth living, is about whether we turn away from doing the best job we can of making sense of the truths of our lives, without fear or favour.

CriglCragl
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  • Sometimes though it is not worth doing the best job you can. "*Why should you destroy yourself?*" – Scott Rowe Oct 26 '22 at 13:25
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    @ScottRowe: "The unexamined life is, maybe ok I guess..?" I feel the Buddhist perspective is to try & be awake to how things are, as our highest priority, as our core job. You not down with that? – CriglCragl Oct 26 '22 at 18:24
  • Yes, I agree. I suppose I got triggered by "the best you can". As an internal approach, sure, always aim to be aware. But when it comes to negotiating life with others, there seem to be many opportunities to do harm, be harmed, waste one's time and energy... There were times when the Buddha was silent, although we have to assume he knew the best answer. (Until someone poisoned him) – Scott Rowe Oct 26 '22 at 20:30
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    @ScottRowe: *thinks silently how sometimes silence is the best answer* "One day the Buddha silently held up a flower before the assembled throng of his disciples." "A good horse runs at the shadow of the whip" – CriglCragl Oct 26 '22 at 21:11
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The problem, of course, is that there is disagreement what truth is. That changes the means that would be necessary to defend it. Consider these two:

  • RAND, a think tank with close ties to the American government and military, has been writing about what they call truth decay.
  • Fox News has been trying to set itself apart from 'mainstream media,' as they call it, and to tell the stories which they consider under-reported.

Each might think that the other is part of the problem.

o.m.
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  • I would say that truth is more of a method than a static repository of information. Some people are better at apprehending reality than others. – Scott Rowe May 27 '22 at 16:50
  • @ScottRowe, hence the RAND comments on media education. When an ad comes along telling "what insurance companies/banks/this or that industry doesn't want you to know," I immediately wonder what they try to sell to me. – o.m. May 27 '22 at 16:53
  • So, my silly take on it that there are no "legitimate sources of truth", as the question asks about. We know the truth when we personally smack in to it in a way that is irrefutable. Otherwise, it's just belief, another word for delusion. I love the story where that ancient Greek guy yelled, "I refute it thus!" and kicked a big stone. Maybe wrong anecdote... – Scott Rowe May 28 '22 at 23:18
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    @ScottRowe, even then objective truth will be filtered and interpreted through pre-existing biases, and it won't be obvious to all. There are still a few people who believe that the Earth is flat, or that smoking doesn't cause cancer, or that climate change is unrelated to fossil fuels. – o.m. May 29 '22 at 04:16
  • @ScottRowe it makes no sense to say someone can filter the objective truth. When some one does so they get called out period. Now you are into playing psychological games when people do things like that. They fail to be rational at that point and no intellectual reasoning can be done reliably. Deductive reasoning is not about how people speak or argue. It is about evaluating arguments for what they mean regardless of how they are stated. This way no emotions creep in. No emotions means less of a chance for deception to be present. – Logikal May 31 '22 at 01:49
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    @Logikal This illustrates what this Answer says: "*disagreement about what truth is*". As I see it, truth is me seeing or otherwise interacting with something right now. Both me and it are one indivisible thing called "what is". Everything else is not that. Most people have not experienced that, and will never see it that way, so they will always be *talking about* truth, which as useful as talking about food instead of eating. Eat! Then, shut up! Because there's really nothing to be said about... What is! After you have 'eaten', you feel much happier and less inclined to argue about words. – Scott Rowe May 31 '22 at 09:52
  • There are different types of truth. There are contingent truths & objective truths for instance. Which one do you mean? You make it sound as there is only one which is false. Do you now see how terminology matters? These details matter. One should not make assumptions that some things are GIVEN. You can err making an assumption that you think is common sense. Use the terminology correctly & many errors will be avoided. As is the OP presents a dialogue where person A could be accidentally correct. People dont seem to like that fact. All sciences are based on probabilities! So no fallacy. – Logikal May 31 '22 at 11:09
  • @Logikal I wonder what is so wrong with being accidentally correct? I'll take that over being deliberately wrong. But, as my comment to the Question shows, there are no objective truths. (except that one. There has to be the one exception...) – Scott Rowe Oct 26 '22 at 13:31
  • @Scott Rowe, So you are telling me that being accidentally correct means more to you than the quality of your knowledge? Your view is more of a pragmatic one. That type of view one usually finds in Rhetoric. There are differences between rhetoric and philosophy. Epistemology is something you should look into more if you want to know why the quality of truth matters. – Logikal Oct 26 '22 at 16:28
  • @Scott Rowe, How is an exception rational? Again that is more psychology or rhetoric than philosophy. If I say all people in the room are women except Bill does that literally mean there is at least one person who is not a woman? If so then the claim about ALL people in the room must be false. This is basic deductive logic. There are no exceptions. That is more of an instance of someone pulling rank over subordinates. Can you give me an exception example of a subordinate speaking to superiors that is rational? – Logikal Oct 26 '22 at 16:34
  • @Logikal Sorry, I seem to have said something offensive without meaning to. – Scott Rowe Oct 26 '22 at 20:33