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I just got hold of the 2006 Kurt Rosenwinkel transcriptions book and I'm looking through some of the lead sheets and getting confused by some chord symbols.

For example the chords for the first 8 bars for 'The Cloister' (after the drums & piano intro) are:

Ami7 - A/C7(b9) - Db/G - F#/C - F#7sus - Ami7(b6) - CMaj7 - CMaj7

What does an A over a C7(b9) mean? From my (limited) knowledge the something/something notation is used to indicated a particular inversion by specifying the bass note. But here we have full chords!

Does that mean a C7(b9) with an A triad? So essentially a C7(b9)13?

It's also worth mentioning that in some other tunes ('Brooklyn Sometimes' for example) he also uses chords like CMaj7/D so we can have chords both over and under?

Any tips appreciated, thank you!

Aaron
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tomasn4a
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2 Answers2

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Generally slashes are used for a bass note under a chord like Db/G, a Db triad with G in the bass.

Poly chords, one chord stacked over another are usually indicated by a horizontal line between the two chords:

enter image description here

It is essentially a C13b9 like you say but I believe the intention is to have the triad at the top of the voicing, basically an upper structure triad.

It’s less ambiguous to use slashes for bass notes and horizontal lines for poly chords, I don’t know if he makes that distinction or not.

As for the Cmaj7/D, this is a D root under Cmaj7, a typical way jazz players play a sus chord, with an added 9 and 13 and no 5.

John Belzaguy
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  • Do you mean a D root over - or under - Cmaj7? I read it as lowest note D, rest of chord Cmaj7 - D, C, E, G, B. So if it's perceived as a sus, it has both 2 and 4, and b7 and 13. Could be called 'D13(no3)..? -As it has 7,9,11 and 13. It's a new one on me! – Tim Sep 30 '20 at 13:50
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    @Tim I do, correction made, I was standing on my head at the time, lol! – John Belzaguy Sep 30 '20 at 13:51
  • Times like that, it's sometimes better to have someone else standing on your head... – Tim Sep 30 '20 at 13:52
  • @Tim seriously though, this is one of those rare cases where a chord voicing is taken literally, C E G B over a D root. – John Belzaguy Sep 30 '20 at 13:55
  • Stuff like this is easy on keyboard, but potentially impossible on guitar. That actual one is *just* playable on guitar. Much easier when bass plays the D. – Tim Sep 30 '20 at 14:02
  • @Tim How do you do it? I come up a finger short! Open E string? Guitarists have to make choices as to what to include and exclude in many voicings. In this case some would opt to make it a C/D and leave out the B or play the B and leave the root for the bassist like you said, very typical in jazz anyway. – John Belzaguy Sep 30 '20 at 14:14
  • 10, 10(M), 10, 9, 8, 7 thick to thin. Muting isn't easy, so I'd use all five digits, missing the 5th string. Using pinky as a half-barre. Like I say *just*... on a really good actioned guitar! – Tim Sep 30 '20 at 15:25
  • @Tim I thought maybe 10-x-10-12-12-0 But that only works for that specific chord. I’m not good with those half-barres on lower strings! – John Belzaguy Sep 30 '20 at 17:28
  • There's a story that, while Kurt was at Berklee, he had mastered all of the chord voicings his guitar teachers could offer and he got sick of playing the same voicings. So he started randomly tuning his guitar, and then he would learn how to play with that tuning and would explore the chord voicings that were possible. – jdjazz Oct 01 '20 at 02:51
  • Ridiculously interesting conversation, thanks everybody. Quick question @JohnBelzaguy, when you say C13b9 with an A triad on top are we supposed to aim for A-C#-E, in that order? (Assuming the fingering is possible for us guitarists) – tomasn4a Oct 01 '20 at 16:48
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    @tomasn4a there is no set way to do it. C13b9 has an A triad built into it. Some might play something as simple as C-Bb underneath then play the triad in whatever inversion they choose. You can even omit the root if there’s a bass player. Obviously guitarists are a little more limited in their choices than pianists are (10 notes at a time? Lucky @#$*% !) but there are several ways to do it for sure. One is 8-X-8-6-5-5 and another is 8-X-8-9-10-9. – John Belzaguy Oct 01 '20 at 20:11
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    @jdjazz Random tuning? I have enough trouble dealing with the single M3 between the G and B strings! Part of the reason I became a bass player, lol. – John Belzaguy Oct 01 '20 at 20:21
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Having looked at some online samples of Kurt Rosenwinkel's work, it seems the transcriber makes no distinction between polychord notation (two chords written as a fraction, one above and one below a horizontal line) and slash/bass notation (one chord, slash, bass note). This is very confusing! Sometimes context clarifies - G/E♭m can only be a polychord - but F/Eb is then ambiguous! Sloppy.

enter image description here

Laurence
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