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We are building a home. We selected a solid pine floor which comes prefinished. It has tongue-and-groove on the sides, but not the ends. The builder & installer did NOT cut the ends of the boards to ensure tight square butt joints, so we have a large number of but joints with out-of-square gaps. See photos.

The builder and installer said that the supplier (a third generation outfit in GA) told them they shouldn't cut the ends in order to preserve the finished ends of the boards. When I spoke with the supplier he said "I told them no such thing! They should have cut them and then used the can of finish that came with the wood to finish the cut edge." That is what makes sense to me. The builder's story doesn't make a lick of sense except that they were trying to get the work done fast and cheap.

What are the acceptable standards for installation of solid pine flooring?

Thanks much!
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208_man
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  • Did you ask for a "rustic barn floor look"? Unless you specifically asked for a turn of the century inspired floor, that looks unacceptable. What is the last image? A transition or threshold? – JPhi1618 Nov 11 '21 at 19:02
  • It does seem like it should been done better, since I imagine they the tools to do a good job. My opinion only since they might have trying for rustic look. – crip659 Nov 11 '21 at 19:03
  • @JPhi1618, to answer your first question, we definitely did not request a rustic barn floor look. And yes the last image is a transition from living room to tiled kitchen. – 208_man Nov 11 '21 at 19:18
  • Also, builder said if the floor were sanded and refinished, one could fill the gaps with some kind of filller. Apart from the high cost of that solution, everything we've heard is that filler won't stain the same color and is notorious for popping out. – 208_man Nov 11 '21 at 19:22
  • Bet the builder does not want to pay for sanding and refinishing. – crip659 Nov 11 '21 at 19:45
  • @crip659 At first he was willing to, but when he quoted it out he changed his mind. – 208_man Nov 11 '21 at 20:38
  • This is a $16k floor between materials and labor. – 208_man Nov 11 '21 at 20:38
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    This is mainly a problem between the builder/installer and yourself. Would send the suppler these and more pictures of the floor and see what they say, but butt joints should be an easy cut to make and look right. This might be question for the law se sister site. – crip659 Nov 11 '21 at 20:46
  • Although I will say that the selection of pine for a floor all but indicates the desire for a rustic (and therefore roughly-built) floor. Pine is soft and knotty and gets beat up quickly and is really only ever selected specifically for an old, hand-milled look. With that in mind, "yes" is also a perfectly valid opinion, and most of the bashing of the builder/carpenter here is unwarranted. – isherwood Nov 11 '21 at 23:53
  • @isherwood historically that could be the reputation among some but there are lots of classy applications. This house's upgraded finishes are anything but rustic (costly balustrade, upgraded tile and tile backsplashes, custom walnut cabinets, quartz everywhere and high end plumbing fixtures.) This particular pine cost more than some oak options considered. – 208_man Nov 11 '21 at 23:57

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What you show is not acceptable. Without seeing the overall floor I couldn't say whether the whole job is unacceptable or just those few spots. It looks to me like his miter saw is off by a degree or a half. Some of the gaps along the long edge could be from the floor boards not being a uniform width but if that's the case you generally use those where it's not noticeable.

Platinum Goose
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  • Op stated that no cuts were made. The contractor should have squared each end with a mitre saw – Kris Nov 11 '21 at 22:06
  • @platinum-goose, I have shown photos of some of the worst joints. There are plenty of joints that are square and fairly 'tight'. I'd guess that about 60% are good, 25% are just ok, 10% are not good, and 5% are awful. I've shown a mix of the not good and the awful. – 208_man Nov 11 '21 at 22:54
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I've never seen flooring like this installed without mitering the edges. Filling in those gaps with a wood filler and refinishing would look terrible. Tongue and grove is done for a tight fit and ensures a tight butt joint but the ends have to be cut. This is definitely unacceptable and you should be getting back with the installer,

JACK
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  • You've never seen _pine_ without beveled edges? Ever been in any cabin, ever? :) – isherwood Nov 11 '21 at 23:51
  • @isherwood I've seen beveled but not lousy end cuts... not many cabins down here.. they don't like the humidity.. :-) – JACK Nov 12 '21 at 00:28
  • The pre-finished engineered hardwood floors I installed did not have to have their ends cut. They were true from the factory. The only cutting that was needed was at the ends of the runs. – SteveSh Nov 12 '21 at 00:47
  • @SteveSh The engineered hardwood floors are different from what the OP has. Yes, they are true from the factory and easy to install. – JACK Nov 12 '21 at 02:14
  • @isherwood I'd guess the OP is looking for a better grade of finish than a log cabin. Not into their pioneer-frontier cosplay. :) – Graham Nov 12 '21 at 09:47
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The agency that controls grades, tolerances, installation requirements, etc. is the MFMA, which started with maple flooring, but has beached out to include many species and grades. See below:

https://www.maplefloor.org/MFMAMainSite/media/Technical-Literature/MFMA-Resid-Broch-FINAL.pdf

This installation is not acceptable for most exposed flooring installations. (Maybe okay for closets, etc.).

There is nothing in the Code that requires specific tolerances for wood flooring. If you did not establish tolerances or installation requirements before work started, it will be difficult to reject the installation now that it’s complete. Did you say “like my neighbors house “? Or like the display at the local flooring store? If so, you could ask for it to be repaired.

Did the wood come pre-cut, with installation instructions, etc.? If so, you could show that it is not installed properly.

Installation instructions would also require the wood be acclimated and for how long, etc. If the boards were not acclimated then your worst problems are ahead of you.

Edit:

Contractors are required to be licensed. If he is not licensed where you live (call the local building code department) then you do not have to pay him. If he is, you could contact the local contractors license agency and ask their advice. They have committees that review problems like this and help resolve these issues. (Here it’s called the Builder’s Board.)

Lee Sam
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  • thanks for posting. We ordered the product from a website (www.vintagepineflooring.com) which shows lovely photos of installs. We ordered in a sample. We had the builder look at both the site and the sample and asked if he thought this was a good product. We expected it to be tight and square. Yes it was precut. With 5 mos of build delays, the product was stored in builder's shop. I do know it had acclimation instructions, which were not followed. Though we live in a desert so that might help. – 208_man Nov 11 '21 at 22:57
  • Depending on where the product was manufactured, the desert environment might cause the lumber to dry out more than normal over time (2 years) causing it to twist, bend, shrink, etc. more than normal. – Lee Sam Nov 11 '21 at 23:03
  • @lee_sam thank you. Hopefully not since it was kiln dried to a pretty low moisture level. But that could well be. We intend to install a humidifier in the HVAC to keep a stable moisture level. – 208_man Nov 11 '21 at 23:09
  • Thanks for the tip about the local contractors license agency. – 208_man Nov 11 '21 at 23:10
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When I spoke with the supplier he said "I told them no such thing! They should have cut them and then used the can of finish that came with the wood to finish the cut edge."

Not sure what else there is to discuss.

There's no such thing as a home improvement police so you need to fight this with the builder yourself.

If you can get the supplier to repeat their words in writing, such as email, then that would be good to have.

MonkeyZeus
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  • Thanks. It's new construction so the money question is between us an our builder. – 208_man Nov 12 '21 at 14:42
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    @208_man No problem, I wish you the best. That threshold is hot steaming poo by the way; just like the builder's and installer's demeanor. The installer definitely "cut corners"; err, lack thereof in this case? – MonkeyZeus Nov 12 '21 at 14:45