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While there are some exceptions, physics generally holds that the universe has a beginning.

Assuming that there is a first cause of the universe, what are the logical based reasons for preferring either simple/unintelligent first cause or a complex/intelligent first cause?

Joseph Hirsch
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  • This rather broad. Are you looking for something specific? On this Q&A site, it helps if you can narrow the question. – J D Dec 13 '21 at 17:25
  • Maybe I should eliminate II. – Joseph Hirsch Dec 13 '21 at 17:44
  • Up to you! :D I think One alone is a handful, so might not be a bad idea. I'd combine One A, B, C so that it asks moving from "nothing to simple states culminating with intelligent life". Then you'll be down to one question that asks about philosophical theories of cosmological origins. You might want to indicate if you are looking for an exposition on the arguments that inhere to "Big Bang", or something more broadly. $0.02. – J D Dec 13 '21 at 17:48
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    What is a "simple cause"? – Conifold Dec 14 '21 at 03:25
  • @Conifold I don’t know. I heard Richard Dawkins say that we should look for the simplest explanation but maybe he means the simplest that’s required over one with unnecessary superfluous adjectiv s. – Joseph Hirsch Dec 14 '21 at 03:55
  • You got a second closure vote so I proposed some clarifications to stave off closure. Feel free to roll back. – J D Dec 15 '21 at 07:05
  • @JD Well, my real question is why a thinking person would prefer a default position that if there is a prime mover it would be simple rather than complex (or vice versa), or that it be intelligent rather than unintelligent (or vice versa) etc. – Joseph Hirsch Dec 15 '21 at 16:15
  • Ahhhh. Well that adds a dimension... let's get that up there somehow. – J D Dec 15 '21 at 16:16
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    Let me take a crack at it. – Joseph Hirsch Dec 15 '21 at 16:19

3 Answers3

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Nothing versus something

If nothing caused the Big Bang, then the Big Bang was not caused by anything, it just happened. Or how could nothingness cause somethingness? How could an empty function on zero, return any number other than zero?

Simple versus complex

There is a tendency to suppose that simple inputs, when coupled with sufficiently complex functions, yield progressively complex outputs. The functions in question, here, would be the laws of physics; the inputs, the state of matter/energy (such as it was) "in the beginning." We seem unable to avoid having either the matter or the form of physics, be relatively complex, in order to yield a complex enough later cosmos; though the preference is to attribute the complexity to the form, rather than to the matter.

Unintelligent versus intelligent

I stayed at a homeless shelter in Salt Lake City for almost a year, and we often had a creationist preacher come by for nightly chapel services. He thought it was silly to think that the materials used to construct large buildings might just fly together by happenstance, into the shape of a building. I concurred, technically, but I was also aware that carbon, which is one of the key chemical bases of known life, has a reliable capacity to form complex structures according to otherwise "unintelligent" quasi-geometrical principles. As far as I know, no state of affairs that obtains in the modern universe, clearly absolutely requires a primordial intellect to explain (though some require non-primordial intellects, e.g. facts about human-produced artifacts).

Kristian Berry
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  • Your point about carbon seems to be meaningless. We have factories producing tons of organic compounds, directed by humans. So you cannot say that all the carbon compounds occurring in nature were not designed by some intelligence unless you can provide some objective way to distinguish them from those that humans created, or unless you claim that humans are without any intelligence. – user21820 Dec 25 '21 at 16:46
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    I never used the phrase "carbon compounds." I referred to more general carbon *structures*. The point is that the complex structure of a building made of metal, wood, mortar, nails, etc. is not the product of lower-level chemical rearrangements in the same relevant kind of way that complex carbon-based life is the product of such rearrangements. – Kristian Berry Dec 26 '21 at 01:57
  • Your comment doesn't make sense either; life as we know it is not the product of mere low-level chemical rearrangements. All cell biologists understand and view the cell as a complex entity with complexity surpassing even that of human factories. – user21820 Dec 26 '21 at 06:57
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'Has a beginning' is problematic if time started there. What does 'before time' mean?

We know reconciling relativistic spacetime with the quantum picture is the biggest challenge in physics - explaining time in terms of something else.

As discussed here we either look to a higher dimensional space like brane space or the E8 octonion hyperstructure, or some kind of monism with dimensions as emergent symmetries: How can time have a beginning when a beginning needs time? This latter could fit say with conformal cyclic cosmology, where complexity & structure emerged through repeated cycles from a foundation of the uncertainty principle.

Causation is deeply suspect, as Hume pointed out what we really have are regularities. Causation seems to be part of a cognitive bias towards narratives, as discussed here: Is the idea of a causal chain physical (or even scientific)?

J D
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CriglCragl
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  • Good points all. I would say that the issue of relative time is important since we don't really know what it means to have time pass at a time when relativity would have broken down. Also the issue of causality. Nevertheless its not an answer. My question assumes a cause of spacetime outside of spacetime, which many theists and scientist both accept, and asks why one kind would be preferred over another, primarily IN LIEU of evidence. Should one be the default? – Joseph Hirsch Dec 14 '21 at 13:39
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This type of question represents a very active area of mathematical physics research. Great volumes have been written about it but they all require a lot of mathematical training to understand because the problem is extremely complex. As such, philosophy has nothing useful to contribute to the field.

It is also worth noting that if we run time backwards and track the universe right back to when we know it began, there comes a point in the exercise where the conditions in the very, very early universe become so extreme that all our mathematical models of what's happening up to that point are known to break down. Earlier than that (we're talking just millionths of a second after the Big Bang!) we have no useful theories to guide the model building and no one can say what was going on there.

One of the very few useful books written for nonphysicists on this topic is The First Three Minutes by Stephen Weinberg. I highly recommend it.

niels nielsen
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  • There are many, many theories about before the Big Bang, eg it was something Hawking worked on extensively & published essays drawn from his talks, as Black Holes & Baby Universes. McTaggart is an example of philosophy helping physics, with his structuring of the discussions about time into A & B theories widely used by physicists. Physics begins in the maths, but over time is made intelligible & accessible without, as say General Relativity is now. Meaning understanding & discussion don't require the math, even if critique & new ideas typically do need formalising mathematically. – CriglCragl Dec 14 '21 at 11:18
  • +1 Appeals to my intuitions that theories about the physical universe should be kept distributed from non- empirical metaphysical speculation. – J D Dec 14 '21 at 15:59
  • @CriglCragl, "widely used by physicists"? Please furnish references so I can read them. best regards, Niels – niels nielsen Dec 14 '21 at 19:18