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Background:

First house, built in the late 60s, bought in October 2014. Original house has crawlspace with combination cinder/concrete foundation. Master bedroom is an addition to the house with a basement underneath.

Problems:

1.) The house was sold to us with what sounds like an open pipe from the master bathroom addition leading straight into the crawl, instead of the sewer. We've been dumping sewage in our crawl for a couple months. Ew.

2.) The plumbing, ductwork, and joist support underneath the house is a cobbled-together mess. One of the joist supports fell, leading me to investigate the crawl, leading me to discover problem #1. I can't get down there to fix it, 'cause of the small amount of working room, and the poop.

Right now, I've got all vents open, and I'm running an industrial blower into the crawl 24/7 to try and dry it out. (Obviously, we are not using the offending plumbing right now.)

Solution:

I want to excavate a good 6" to 1',6" of dirt from down there, for two reasons: 1.) There is too much dirt (not enough space to work on the problematic plumbing, ductwork, and joist supports) and 2.) an unacceptable portion of that dirt is now poop.

I'm not talking about turning it into a basement or anything, just pulling out a bunch of dirt and possibly laying down some gravel instead, so I have a sanitary and sufficiently large area in which to address the other problems this old house has.

Do I need to pull permits or hire a structural engineer for something like this?

VanGoghComplex
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  • Just for excavation I don't think you need engineer, you just need to be careful (there might be cables, pipes etc.).When it comes to permits you should check with local authorities. Now, depending on what you find when you are done with excavation, and what you want to do maybe you will need engineer at that stage...keep us posted – python starter Mar 09 '15 at 15:25
  • That's good to know. I'm not too worried about buried pipes or cables, because I will likely be doing all the digging by hand. This idea is in its infancy and somewhat relies on a suspicion that I have a crawlspace access that's been graveled over in my garage. Otherwise, removing the dirt is going to suck! – VanGoghComplex Mar 09 '15 at 15:30
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    When digging by hand, be careful of "roots" - some of them turn out to be wires. – Ecnerwal Mar 09 '15 at 15:33
  • Well wouldn't it be much easier to dig around garage, if that is the reason? – python starter Mar 09 '15 at 15:34
  • @python starter: The garage is just a concrete slab on dirt. I think it was an addition as well. I believe they installed the slab over an old exterior access to the crawlspace, as there is currently no other exterior access. The interior access is in a very inconvenient location for removing the dirt through. – VanGoghComplex Mar 09 '15 at 15:35
  • @Ecnerwal: Thanks, I'll remember that. I'm hoping I don't have much cable to worry about; all the electrical in my home comes from overhead. – VanGoghComplex Mar 09 '15 at 15:37
  • You should seriously consider hiring a professional for this. You've got a (potentially) large amount of soil contaminated with human waste. Do you really want to be handling that yourself? What are you going to do with the soil? It will need to be treated and disposed of appropriately. – longneck Mar 09 '15 at 15:54
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    I think I'd be talking to a real estate lawyer – CoAstroGeek Mar 09 '15 at 15:57
  • @longneck I've priced professional help for this, and it is not economically feasible for me. As for whether I want to be handling that stuff, of course I don't! It's poop! If I had the cash, I'd hire someone else to do this in a heartbeat. – VanGoghComplex Mar 09 '15 at 16:01
  • @CoAstroGeek: I'm not sure what my options are there. I'm a first-time home buyer, so I'm fairly certain I've been bamboozled one way or the other; either way, if I can't afford to hire professionals to do the work, I certainly can't afford to hire a lawyer to (maybe) prove it's someone else's fault. – VanGoghComplex Mar 09 '15 at 17:29
  • I am not a real estate lawyer, so take this with a big grain of salt. That said, as I understand it, the seller has to disclose significant defects in the property. If this pipe was broken or never properly installed at the time of sale and it wasn't disclosed, I think you have a case. Did you have a pre-sale home inspection done? – CoAstroGeek Mar 09 '15 at 17:40
  • @CoAstroGeek: I did pay for an inspection, and we tested the plumbing. If the problem was present then, we totally missed it. So, I'm not going to be surprised if we "caused" the problem somehow. Perhaps the previous owner (a little old lady living by herself) didn't make much use of the master bath. Maybe the pipe broke this winter. Maybe when I turned up the hot water heater (she clearly had a scalding concern, the hot water topped out at "lukewarm") the hot water caused the ABS pipe to warp and a joint broke. Either way, I signed stuff saying "house looks fine, I'll buy it and like it." – VanGoghComplex Mar 09 '15 at 18:05
  • Don't get to hung up on what you signed. If they didn't make a good faith effort to disclose defects, it won't matter. But yea, the timing of the failure is critical. If it was properly constructed, and failed on your watch, then you're SOL. – CoAstroGeek Mar 09 '15 at 18:11

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